When transitioning to a new career, it is expected that you might have a few gaps in your skills and knowledge. It’s important therefore to prepare yourself properly for your chosen career ahead, as you strive to differentiate yourself from the more experienced competition.
In this episode we discuss how to make the transition into the tech industry. To help us explore this, we’re joined by Tigerlily Jagun-Howell, Associate Product Manager, at Moonpig to share her career pivot story and life at Moonpig.
SheCanCode is a collaborative community of women in tech working together to tackle the tech gender gap.
Join our community to find a supportive network, opportunities, guidance and jobs, so you can excel in your tech career.
hello everyone thank you for tuning in again I am Katie Bateman the content director actually can code and today
we’re discussing how to make a transition into the tech industry and what it’s like to switch now when
transitioning into a new career it is expected that you might have a few gaps in your skills and knowledge it’s
important therefore to prepare yourself properly for your chosen career ahead as you strive to differentiate yourself
from the more experienced competition now I’m joined today by the wonderful Tiger Lily jagen Howe associate product
manager at moonpig who is here to share a career pivot story and life at Moon
Peak hello tiger lily welcome hello thank you so much Kaylee for having me it’s honestly an absolute honor thank
you thank you for joining me we love the fact that you’re joining us today because we’d love to hear um we’re going to talk a little bit
about your career pivot and and how you got into the tech industry so can we kick off with a bit of background about
yourself and and how how you got in yeah well uh I actually have a
um background in criminal justice so I did my degree in criminology I thought I
could change the world of crime and well for some time I probably did and impacted it where I could you know
um and whether that be food like working in in the prisons working in the courts
writing free sentence reports um or working as a probation officer and
working in resettlement and Rehabilitation and with my last thing being working with victims of crime so
it’s yeah but that’s more or less was my life for the past 10 years or the
previous 10 years should I say um and yeah as I was just doing it more
and more and more I thought to myself there’s so much more out there that I
could probably be doing I think crime is an amazing place to work if you are
working with people that commit crime and you’re a part of the change in their lives and their habits and their choices
um but it can be quite a sad place to to work when you kind of are reminded on a
daily basis um why people make the choices they make whether it be through poverty whether it
be through inequality whether it be through um just mental health
um it’s yeah it can be it can be quite sad and I I knew that I’m such a positive person I didn’t really want to
feel like my passion left me before I left the industry so decided to start looking into other
things yeah it’s only like you started with the idea though of making change
and and you know doing doing something good and and you you know and as you said I think you probably realize I must
leave um I’ve done my part and I must move into a sector where I’m assuming you
thought I can still make change and I can still help people but without that negative feeling that I come home with
every day yeah definitely because it was definitely as much as it were it could
be um rewarding it was also quite emotionally taxing um and I don’t know why I think the
older I became the more sensitive and delicate my thick wall became to that
type of information or that type of stuff that was going on in the world it was just like yeah actually I like thinking about settling down becoming a
wife I’m not I’m single a different goal but yeah like we’re coming to life and having children I just don’t want to
know that these things are going on every single day you know within that within those roles in my personal life I
thought to myself yeah I want to step away from this because it was just it was taken over
um so yeah yes definitely and take those skills and and the things
that you’ve learned in that sector and and transfer them I mean there must have been now he’s a transferable skills that
that you brought over I mean I’m thinking skills you know but what about you know skills and qualifications
um do you do you think would be important to that you’ve brought over you know well enough when I was actually
working at MOJ I completed a Princeton don’t know why I just completed the difference there I just wow it’d be good
to have this type of like project management and agile knowledge um but I would say
um a constantly one of the things that you had to do when you’re working in mwj
was training there was so many courses you had to do just to kind of because as a civil servant you have to be seen that
you are also moving with the times so whether it be you know having knowledge
on meant the different cognitive thinking and and behaviors and
um like mental health issues um how to also um work in a workspace in terms of day
data protection because all everything you’re handling is somebody’s personal information and you know from what they
divulge to you to what you are sent from different um like different agencies you work with
a relatively mental health or the doctors or Social Services child
protection home office is just a realm of different people you work with on a
daily basis so constantly we were doing different training um which I would say
but it when I then got into Tech it just was like okay oh this continues here as well they do the same stuff here you
know things like whistle blowing or things like you know um knowing character like information
security just does so much things um that are transferable that I didn’t
realize um would be until I was gearing up for
that change I think the lack of knowing what skills would be transferable
probably kept me you know there for longer had I have known that actually
these skills will be valuable elsewhere I probably would have made the jump a
lot sooner yeah yeah and it’s quite a mindset of of somebody as well to to be
in a job where they were okay with the fact that you have to keep training and constantly learning because not everybody has that mindset but we hear
that a lot in the tech industry that the the people that uh that are here you know they they want to keep developing
and pushing forward um and and that’s that’s something quite unique about this industry you have to
stay um ahead of the curve and but it just sounds like you just naturally you know came over that’s fine I can I can
keep you know learning and moving forward that’s something I’ve been doing for years yeah yeah that that if I’m
honest with you I was very fortunate um to have a brother that has worked in the
technology industry his whole life um but he did do you know did have does
have a computer science background you know does have business and like so much and
um yeah different qualifications and different skill set to what I have so I just would think oh loved when you’d
come home and tell me things that you’d been doing or and work would send him to different countries I was just like oh
I’d love to do that um and I and I think he could see that and he said says I think you’d be a
really good product manager and I and I said why and this was when I was working in the courts so a lot of that was like
looking into Data Gathering requirements you know working with
um looking into patterns of crime and working with um different stakeholders to understand
what could be possibly done as an alternative to somebody go into custody is there any
programs that we could do if we could create for this person instead um and obviously then having the the
power to influence a judge to not send somebody to prison and if anything to
take on the proposal you’ve given um and I didn’t understand it there Anita and I said oh what’s a product
manager and he says well I’m not going to spoon feed you do your own research you know I’d be able once you’ve done
that we’ll look in we’ll we’ll look further into it um because at the time I was just adding
in just some more I try to try and keep my CV up to date so that it’s not lost
um and I was adding stuff into my CV and he said oh yeah he was just looking at my CV
um from afar and said yeah you’ve got a lot of I think you’d really either taught me through your job what do you do and I
was telling him and he was like yeah and then he says that and he walks away and then I then start looking at what
product manager is and stuff and we then speak again and he said
take a job a jobs back from a product manager and look at what your what you
do now in your job and see what transferable skills what can you say you currently do that you could you feel
you’d be strong enough to do that as well um and they just started to become
quite clear parallels but the difference was is my my
um my products were my people the people I was working with um but now when I think about when I’m
working at moonpig you know but it’s a it’s a customer facing tool it’s a customer facing
um organization business company so don’t think that okay yeah actually it
this this becomes more or less you just go and you’re just looking at it through a different angle instead of looking at
people are committing crime you’re looking at people that are trying to buy a card but it’s still people at the center of it so yeah and he took
somebody to to point that out did you think before you know in terms of
it’s skills in tech people tend to think that’s not for me because I don’t have you know a computer science degree from
University and and they just kind of you know they they don’t even consider it I think you know my chance was gone I’m
not even going to consider it but like you said there’s so many roles that people don’t know about product management is is one of them yeah
definitely so to be honest I I probably say for about two three years I
was thinking oh gosh wish I could do something else but I just didn’t know what that would be like I didn’t think
it would be something that would allow me to be both creative but also at the
same time academic like because I’m naturally an academic and but then at the same time in my spare time I’ve
always been a very creative person so in my like no my time so I was trying to think oh what could I do that would
allow me to have that balance or um because but it was yeah it was difficult
I started looking into different things but then I thought it didn’t really feel like it would be for me like I admitted I was going to go
down a route of like international relations but that involved going to go and do an MMA in it and I was like oh
yeah I don’t want to go back to Unity to change careers yeah that’s quite a
commitment to and we hear that often on here when people talk about changing careers the thought of having to retrain
or you know I’ve had ladies on here tell me I had to take um you know I had to make the commitment
of making a very intense boot camp over several months or I had to give up my job to do it and financially you’re
thinking can I do this can I actually and right at the end you might think well that was a Gamble and actually I
didn’t get the job I wanted you know it’s it’s it’s such a a big um uh career move to making a big
decision in terms of moon pig how how does moonpig support you in in your new
career I mean it sounds like they were okay with a career transition and they sound very supportive if in that what
what happened there if I wanted to I was so fortunate because I had
um prior to so I had I um before obviously what joining me pick
I was I and I thought I’m part of a um Tech Community that’s trying to more or less challenge
um we’re not trying like works on the issues around that diversity or the lack of diversity in Tech called black Valley
um and I was fortunate enough to um ascertain a space on it it’s like quite well sought after
um as you can imagine everybody’s trying to you know jump into Tech and I think probably more so after covid
um where people felt like they wanted a job that was remote where they didn’t have to work with people feel like they would lose their jobs because you know
or having to face people like in in the public um and I had a mentor from there and I
if I wanted to view without even having to really look for it I had somebody from black Bali give me a nudge and say
hey I’ve just seen this role um for moonpig as an associate product management role
um I think you should apply and I looked at it and I looked at the jobs back and
I as you can imagine the information the information that I’d received from Blackberry was like go go after an
Associated product management role um they’re more likely to kind of take you on and meet you where you are where
you um are but what I was Finding so much was they were expecting an
associate to have three to five years product management experience and I didn’t understand it and I was even
interviewing and I was just still like this doesn’t make sense how can somebody that’s entry level have three to five
years experience yeah this is strange so it was quite demotivating
um and then Moon pigs associate product management um job comes up and I look at the spec
and straight away it says in bold clear work like writing you do not need to
have a background in Tech we want to make sure that we are
um diversifying our portfolio of talent and we want we want to see you know this is they were thinking of like for people
that are trying to transition like myself into a new career or returning mums from like maternity leave or
long-term child care and I just thought to myself oh my gosh this this can’t be
true this can’t be real and I was looking and I was looking on that same day I’ve bestowed my heart and soul into
this application it’s really simple in terms of like it asks three questions and don’t get me wrong there was like
probably I think it was a four or five stage interview process but you know knowing that actually it was
all about who you are what skills that you bring that is unique is a fresh
perspective was just I was like no I I need to get this job yeah and and like
just just so knowing that you’re willing to learn and oh gosh companies actually practicing what they preach because yeah
you hear it so often that you know there’s a tech Talent shortage and companies need to do more and companies
need to work harder to find talent and then encourage that talent to to learn
and progress within their own company and you’re right you’ll get on an interview for something and then they want years of experience that yeah
you’re not going to invest in me are you at this point so yeah so it was it was crazy so I think because of what the um
job it was itself and what they were expecting from you they already knew
um you know that they were gonna they they had to like support us through this
changing through this process and they were so willing they’ve been so willing to meet me where I’m at um you know for where would that be
through coaching whoever that be free just like when I’m just gonna just giving
um just given really good feedback all the time um and challenging me stretching me as
well like giving me tasks giving me projects that I’m like oh my gosh what you know I should I was surely he’s yeah
I mean what you were looking for anyway from your switching job but it would make you feel more loyal like you want
to stay and you you know want to put your all into that company whereas you’d kind of reach the end of your road at
your in your last career and it sounded like you were just looking for something that’s really lifted you yeah and I
think um one of the one of one of the things that for me really stood out about
um moving and still does is the nurturing aspect of you know management of the company
um as well because coming into a space where not only is it a new industry it’s
also a culture shock as well you know it’s a behavior shock it’s a
um industry shocked as well just you know working in mlj was amazing but at the
same time you’re you’re not selling like maybe we’re
selling cards and Flowers and Gifts working at mlj what I was what we’re
focused we were focusing on there was risk management trying to prevent a crime from happening or somebody’s coming out from prison having to inform
the victims it was a lot of pressure so people didn’t really have time to necessarily be nice
to one another they were just getting it done moving like robots because you know Take Your Eye Off the ball and suck a
serious further offense can happen and your name is on it and nobody wants that so it’s like working on walking on
eggshells as well as Moon piggy just got like okay I’m coming into a completely new world here but I’ve been I’ve I’ve
been allowed to be completely vulnerable and transparent with what I do and what I don’t know
um and what I’m what I want to learn and how I want to grow and to be a part of an organization without saying hey we’ve
got you we’ve got we’ve got your support let’s see where you’re at right now and let’s work towards things and actually
having like objectives and and naturally constantly updating like my learnings
and you know also like allowing me to even be a part of a a
training platform as well that you know they’ve obviously covered in terms of cost wise so that I could develop my
skills as well from an external provider so it’s just been it’s been an amazing
um like overwhelming experience of what am I like completely OverWatch like I still pinch myself because I’m just like
how is how is how is this possible like yeah I’m assuming MOJ there would have
been a process for things quite rightly you know a process that people follow well just it sounds quite rigid in in a
way whereas now you know if you they’re probably asking your opinion at moonpig and what you want to do and it tells you
creative and that you can really did you think that though when when you
you were coming into the tech industry did a lot of people they they had this
misconception about tech it’s boring and it’s rigid and it’s dry and people just sit with their headphones on all day did
you think that or yeah I did I thought it’d be full of people
that are like really really smart and really uptight and you know um Geniuses
I’m not getting them wrong there are really really smart people and Geniuses you know intact um but they’re not
uptight they’re fun they’re just regular people being creative working together
collaborating and making magic happen um and I definitely that was not my like
yeah my concept of it I I did think that it’d be it’s probably gonna be really boring and I’m going to be like the most
outgoing person and you know also like oh like Alicia’s
okay I’ve got away suit gotta wear high heels because that was what I was used to and that was what I thought Tech was
about as well and then I remember my first bit office visit I was told oh
don’t worry about you know just come as you are come I’ll review the world I’m not gonna be wrong I love wearing suits
and heels um I don’t know it’s just to do like power dressing but at the same time what
I didn’t want to do was stand out like coming in my first week I just wanted to fit in um and yeah I think I will ablazer a
tank top and some jeans and trainers and that felt so weird coming in and just
seeing everyone says hey how are you you’re right and just you know
learning more about people that I’d known for five minutes over a cup of coffee whereas I worked in a team for a
year and had no idea who they were or even how they looked because they wouldn’t even switch on their videos and on on camera and stuff so it was
such uh a refreshing but a very overwhelming change and it definitely
proved my um prerequisite it’s completely wrong like I yeah couldn’t never in my wildest
dreams of imagined it would be like this like yeah do you find your your
karma in yourself in terms of you know work-life balance and and and everything
about the industry do you just you know now think back to the industry that you used to work in and you think you know
what I’m so much calmer in myself and yeah it sounds like you look forward to
work now as well which makes such a difference in everybody’s life doesn’t it not dreading you know like the Sunday
scaries like when you’re at school and you don’t want to go back on on the Monday nobody wants that in their job
yeah like for me watching the news was my fun day scary because I was just thinking oh I hope one of my clients
wouldn’t be on there or you know dealt with high profile cases so it was like that was my Sunday school whereas now
I’m I I just I’m excited to go to work it’s refreshing it’s so chilled out and
I’m and also my brain capacity I’m constantly always learning and I’m just
like they wouldn’t Maybe for one of a better word for instance if
I go into Sainsbury’s that experience in Sainsbury’s is a learning experience for me there’s something I could take from
that shopping experience that I can take to mimic you know the nature of what the
work is like nothing I do I find is in vain there’s always something that’s a learning for the rest of the team and
how we share and how we contribute nothing’s too small like nothing gets overlooked whereas what would I be able
to say about you know working going to Sainsbury’s working in MOJ just was just irrelevant
okay we don’t care about your shopping trip yeah I just how
and as well that you don’t mind that that bleeds into your personal life did you enjoy it yeah definitely definitely
I was excited like I love reading different texts or learning different books like I’ve got a stack of books and
they’re all to do with tech and stuff but it’s it’s enjoyable like I’m just like oh my gosh I didn’t know that was
the case and these are things that you know that I don’t I’m able to apply to my work will share with my team or The
Wider product team and you know whether or not it it’s utilized straight away it’s something that we can always refer
back to um so yeah like it’s yeah I think um one thing that is inevitable is
change that will never stop happening and I think working in a tech space allows you to kind of embrace that the
most that knowing okay yeah this will always this is always going to happen if anything where you know being Pioneers
but part of that Journey because we are a part of that change as well so so it’s a great thing to kind of witness and be
like oh my gosh you know that person is the one that’s on that and they’ve left their Mark there like it’s a it’s a
beautiful thing to witness yes definitely and you mentioned that you were part of the tech group um before
did you have any technical knowledge before though is it what had you trained
in anything or given anything a go I do I would say yeah just why I can do a
little prince too you know obviously becoming more familiar with agile um I did loads of webinars
um and obviously like the mentorship program I did did give me like a certification but I didn’t have any
technical background yeah which is great to hear and what our listeners love to
hear on this podcast because there there is as we’ve mentioned that misconception that you have to have technical
background um you have to have certain qualifications in order to step foot into the tech industry
um and as you’ve mentioned there are just you know so many different roles where it’s not needed or if you get in
the right company they’ll show you exactly what you need to do anyway yeah and that’s the thing is that even when
even when you when you when you get in like there’s just constant training it
never stops so I think just showing a uh a curiosity to learning and a will a
will a willingness to learn and actually like what are you doing in your own time to kind of show that you are ready to
take this step into transition into something new I think doing those type of things like
webinars and like LinkedIn learning or joining a bit not necessarily even a boot camp but just
subscribing to different texts and different literature things that are going to help you to be able to really
understand the role and the industry and you’re trying to get into because I
think yeah without that it’s almost as though you don’t have like that knowledge and that without that knowledge that knowledge is
powerful right so yeah I think um just showing that willingness to learn I think is um something that I I I think
recruiters find valuable and and see like okay yeah this person is actually
demonstrated they’re ready for this change I think it’s really easy for us to tell you I
want something new but you’ve not done you’ve not done your part of it kind of
thing so yes exactly and working at moving what has been the most
interesting project you’ve worked on so far I mean it sticks in your mind is there’s loads there’s loads of
interesting projects um I would probably say it’s probably recently biased because it’s more recent
um so I’m I I work as a co-chair um for the Embrace committee which is
more or less educating myself on better racial awareness and cultural enrichment
um and that’s like one of the ergs um that we have at Moonbeam so we also have like gender balance committee on
the lgbtq plus committee well obviously you know the Embrace committee is the one that’s thinking about you know race
and culture um and we started the The Kicks of the year and obviously this is a
voluntary work is a socied a side project because it wasn’t like my main
project I work on um but I would say working on this
project what we more or less done is we thought about how can we it in like act as a consultant or I act
as like advisors which is one more or less our mission um to serve like the moon pig group in
becoming um better vast in racial
um and cultural differences like not only in a workplace but also externally as well for our customers
um and we then just started looking at different not different just looking at
widely all the cultures and all the celebrations and all the occasions that
exist looked at that we have all the cars we have those things already but
then just started thinking about how could we become so personalized where if
we are recommending if we are if somebody’s coming on to buy a card for Eid they then will come on and see all
the relevant gifts for that occasion um and yes that was more or less one of
the projects silhouette in progress but um we kicked off
um with that project and it just yielded really good um results and we increased
um gifts that were gift purchases so yeah it’s just it’s nice to kind of feel
like you are also affecting change that impacts our customers you know and
knowing that oh my gosh like I’ve I’ve been a part of that process and more so because it’s a passion
project it’s not necessarily something that um I’m obviously I go to work to do but
what I love about it is the fact that Moon Peak have allowed me and given me that platform to work on something so
amazing um that you know just benefits society and you know the communities as a whole
yeah did you think when when you joined it was is going to be selling cards
I mean did you have that that those those Sports when you got in like
oh I know they’re not all cards but actually the projects that you work on are they’re so in-depth and creative and
you know would really you know seeing those gifts that are related to whatever it is that you’re celebrating actually
would really make a difference yeah definitely I think you were going to be doing that or would you think back
when you worked at the MOJ that you’d be doing something like that no definitely not
definitely no I mean I I’ve moon pig has always been a company that I’ve been familiar with anyway like I think I’ve
had I got my first movie card probably about comments maybe about 20 years ago so
they’ve always been a company that I was like oh my gosh yeah I use them anyway and so I and I guess it’s always easy to
work for a company that you’re familiar with already um but I guess I didn’t really know when
I was applying for the job like what you know like okay what could I do that was
going to make sure that that customer buying the cards experience is going to change you know and you just you just
have no idea how how much four goes into it
um and yeah so it’s mind-blowing because although we sell cards and gifts a lot
goes behind behind making sure that that experience for that customer is perfect
you know um so yeah yeah yeah definitely not
we are almost out of time but I um have a question to ask you about advice for
our listeners do you have any advice um for those who are thinking about a career uh a career transition moving
into Tech um that they might be unsure that it might be later in life though they might
be thinking what you were thinking they might be stuck there thinking well you know I might go but I might not go is
there anything you wish someone had told you yeah so if I’m honest with you I think
um I’m so fortunate with the men I have in my life I love women I have in my life and everyone like just the tribe I
have um but so when I mentioned my brother before it was my older brother and then
my younger brother had um alluded to a quote by Todd Henry
um and I I’ve actually aside from just the quote I’ve actually
um given like a bit of a breakdown with like how what he means and I and if I’m
honest with you I think it was this quote that was shared with me that made me realize
there’s there’s it’s never too late like it is never too late
um somebody had asked Todd Henry um what would you say is like the most
the richest country the richest place in the world and he said the great the
cemetery the graves because people go to their a lot of people go to you
know be buried and they’re taken away all of them they’ve got taken with them all the magic and all of this knowledge
and I was just like what and I literally I went and looked for it myself
um and it simply says um what’s it called do not go to your grave and do not go to your grave and
you carry inside you the best that you have always choose to die empty
um and die an entity is more or less an Express is a new expression and it’s Unique in its own way but it’s talking
about like you know what is the new normal so like if you if
you die empty of all the goodness that is within you um and you deliver it into the wild
before you leave it what you if you have an idea perform it if you have knowledge give it out if you have a goal achieve
it love share distribute do not keep it inside do not keep the goodness inside
of you and Die full of ideas and be a delicious meal for the earthworms in the
grave to eat and honestly I love that not as being something that’s stuck with
me um since I’ve heard it and I’ve just always thought yeah I want to die empty I want to die empty I don’t want to die
full and I think yeah so I just feel like if you have something inside you and you feel like you want a change
you’ve just got to be the change you want to see you just got to go for it and it isn’t going to be easy and it’s scary and it’s a it’s a change and it’s
uncomfortable but I do feel that through adversity comes creativity and you know
it really is better to try um and fail than but than not try at all
I never know kind of thing yeah because what was the worst that that could have happened really when when you wanted to
move careers and if you didn’t work you could have come back or you could have tried something else yeah I think people
just kind of think they get stuck in their career for life and and that’s it um which is sad to hear when the tech
industry are crying out for amazing people honestly it’s like my great granny she passed at 102 and I met her
when she was 98. um yeah because we live in different countries and when I met her and I was
just like you know do you feel like you know it all and she’s like no I’m still learning
he was 98 and she said she’s still learning I just finished my GCS season I thought I knew it all and my great
granny of 98 years old said I’m still learning and explore things like that I
think sometimes we get these Clues and we get these reminders from all around
us like whether we’re going on a shopping trip whether it’s something you know old wise towels something’s off
relatives have told us or a friend um and they act as almost like little signs for us to act on it and until we
do it we keep on getting it and I think if you if you keep getting this feeling to do something just do it because what
is the worst that can happen you get no we’ve been told no all of our lives like you have to get comfortable with her in
the word no and going after your first yes right so yes I love that I heard a
lady on here recently said to me you have to get comfortable with being uncomfortable yeah and I thought that’s absolutely right and it’s exactly just
echoed what you just said that it’s it’s okay I think people think sometimes especially if you’re starting to think
about new career and and you don’t necessarily like the one you’re in that the grass is greener and everything’s
gonna be fantastic on the other side but you you have to get there first you know they’re still going to magically happen
and to be honest it’s then also a completely different exp then also a
different stage a different level a different thing you don’t have to think about now once you are there because you need to
stay there and you need to maintain it and you’re going through all of these emotional changes and you’re like oh my
gosh and it can be an overwhelming experience but then you don’t have to keep looking back and thinking where
you’ve come from as well so it doesn’t actually necessarily get easier once you get in but it becomes more beautiful and
it you know there’s just so much more to it kind of thing because now I think the real work begins once you now are there
and you’re like okay fine I’m here what am I going to do now you know kind of thing and it’s it’s up to you whether
you sink or swim but I think like there’s so much room there’s so much space for everybody and it’s there’s
such a misconception that you need to have a computer science degree or be
tech savvy to be in Tech no we we need a such a wide variety of different
personalities and different experiences and different skill sets because that’s actually how Tech become becomes more
rich as well you know from hearing firsthand from the people that work within it you know because they are also
customers you know so yeah yeah did you find did you feel strange when you moved
over and you were experienced but actually you were experienced in work but actually you weren’t experienced in
your new career I do oh by the sounds of it it was quite easy at the right
company but do you think that would be a bit unusual if you stepped into the wrong company probably quite quick yeah
definitely because I think you know it’s one thing that you you’ve come I I came from being an expert and then now I’m a
novice a beginner and you know you have to embrace that and embrace that you’re
you’re learning and you don’t know it all and sometimes yeah it can you’re battling with yourself kind of thing
because you wanna you’re almost trying to kind of go into this new industry and
be at the level you were where you’ve come from in terms of like your knowledge and you want to prove and
really you know show off and be like yeah I’m doing amazing but actually it
takes a while before you get there um and I think yeah being in a wrong
company that that that might be a problem sometimes because obviously you need to
also make sure that you are being looked after you are being nurtured and and that people are being honest not to say
to you hey we understand that you know you’ve transitioned into something new but you have to let go because that’s the thing
it’s almost you’re relearning and you’re unlearning the things some of the things that are no longer valuable to you yeah
you know you need to let them go and not bring them into a new place because actually it has no space there
and just take with you what you need so that can sometimes be difficult but once you get The Knack of it and it’s not an
overnight thing um but with the right mentors the right leadership the right management and the right
um colleagues and peers you’ll get there right literally
yeah well that is a lovely point to end on because we were already out of time tag Lily thank you so much it’s been so
much fun having you on here today and hearing about your career Journey thank you thank you so much for having me
Kaylee honestly it’s been amazing I’m so grateful so honored um and I just hope somebody finds it
useful actually thank you oh thank you thank you to everybody listening as always thank you for joining us and we
hope to see you again next time
