It is estimated that up to 15% of the UK population are neurodiverse! So shouldn’t we be doing more to help support neurodiverse employees?
Neurodiversity refers to the differences in the human brain and cognition. In other words, we’re not all wired the same way. Neurodiversity can include Autism, ADHD, Dyslexia, Dyspraxia, Tourette’s and many more.
In this episode, we’re joined by Carlene Jackson, CEO, Cloud9 Insight, as we take a look into neurodiversity, how employees can harness their super powers and what more organisations can do to support their neurodivergent employees.
Carlene is the CEO of Brighton-based digital transformation consultancy, Cloud9 Insight, which she founded in 2010. It is a Microsoft Gold Partner that has provided more that 800 UK businesses with cloud-based CRM software systems.
Carlene has over 25 years working in the tech and software industry, is and active speaker on D&I topics and advises Parliament on apprenticeships and training.
A serial entrepreneur, Carlene established her first business aged 17. She was named as one of Real Business Magazine’s Top 25 SME Culture Leaders of 2019, as well as one of the Top 10 Female Tech Entrepreneurs to Watch by About Time Magazine.
hello everyone and thank you for tuning in as always I am Kaylee batesman the content director at chican code and
today we’re discussing neurodiversity it is estimated that up to 15 of the UK
population is neurodiverse so shouldn’t we be doing more to help support neurodiverse employees now today I’m
joined by the wonderful Colleen Jackson CEO of Cloud9 Insight who is going to
dive into the topic of neurodiversity with me and discuss how neurodiverse employees can harness their superpowers
and share or organize organizations can do to support their neurodivergent
employees welcome Colleen thank you for having me it’s great to be here thank
you so much for for joining us for a chat can we set the scene a little bit with a little bit background about
yourself and and what you do please sure so I run a Microsoft partner business
that helps clients in the SME in the sort of medium-sized space in Implement
some of their Cloud technology particularly around sales and marketing and I’ve been running the company for 12
years so I guess you could call me an entrepreneur um and I um I’m actually dyslexic myself
so I feel I can talk from a first-hand perspective around being dyslexic it’s
something that I’ve um known that I’ve had formally since my I was in my early 30s I was doing a
university course and I I couldn’t I can’t spell for toffee uh well certainly some of the the names of the things that
I had to remember and I thought oh my goodness I knew my parents were dyslexic so I thought I’ll I’ll get an assessment
and so and sure enough it confirmed that I have uh for me I’m lucky it’s just a
mild mild dyslexia but I’ve always been really aware of um of neurodiversity my
two of my sisters speak uh specific sort of work with schools that have kids with severe autism so I’ve always been you
could say curious about all the different diversities and I think what’s great is that more and more people out
there are talking about it uh like Elon Musk in the last couple of years has come shared that he has autism uh I was
listening to a podcast recently and Simon sinek was sharing that he has ADHD so it’s it’s really very common and I
think that the more that we talk about and help people understand what does that mean and be confident to share
their own um neurodiversities I think that’s a great thing because for me I think I
really believe that everyone has their own superpowers and and it’s great to talk about that
um they you were diagnosed in in your early 30s yes yeah quite late yeah
because it’s something that I suppose you sort of think of at school or you know I knew some students at University
um but I suppose actually you know as you say you can suddenly realize later in life as well yeah I had a hunch early
on with with my parents being um pathetic for example my mom uh when
my mom was younger we had checkbooks then and for those who might remember them and at the back of her checkbook
she had the words like 1 to 20 written out as as the spelling of those words in
in writing and I said mum why did you do that and she said because I can’t spell any of those words and I thought oh okay
um and it should have made me have an appreciation for her own um dyslexia but um I’m a summer child and I think a lot
of people put the fact that I wasn’t great at my spellings or I wasn’t great at my timetables anything that involved
in memory I wasn’t great at I was great other things and like sports and art and
anything creative and and I was always confident about anything that required a
test of memory uh probably wasn’t so good at and so I had a hunch that I was
and then when I was 18 actually my career aspiration funnily enough I didn’t really uh think about it too much but I I
actually wanted to be an air traffic controller and I I went on to get uh and their traffic control qualification
which I have which I did in my spare time as a hobby and then I applied to the civil aviation Authority and
I passed all of their aptitude tests I passed all of their interviews and they
introduced a new test to tell your left from your right because that’s a common thing with dyslexics they can’t if you tell them if you’re if they’re
navigating for you they might start shouting no right right and you’re you’re going right but actually they
meant left and that would be me but um so I did this as you might expect I
actually failed the test it was a and I think it was a military test that they introduced because too many people were failing at the end of the course and if
you’re telling an aircraft to turn a heading you want to be able to tell say it’s left or right heading or whatever
degrees and you can’t get that wrong because clearly you might be taking a body action with two aircraft you don’t
want them hitting each other so it’s quite important of course and so they invited me to come back the next year
and they said you’ve only failed this one test I’m sure you’ll pass apply next you pass everything else and I then I
thought about it and you probably need to know my husband’s an airline pilot so it’s like it was a bit closer to home so
I thought maybe maybe I should give up on this like as much as I really want to do I love the fast Pacer which which
definitely Tech gives gives me uh that sort of um fast-paced environment uh I decided
you know what this is people’s lives and I parked that ambition and um stayed in Tech because that’s where I
was and I’m I have absolutely no regrets because it’s it’s a fantastic place where uh if you like a fast pace and you
love to sort of where things are changing all the time and um you get challenged and you can solve
real world business problems I think there’s no better place to be and of course the earning potential even if you
have no degree is fantastic as well so it’s another motive yeah there are
wonderful benefits um to the tech sector we we talk about them a lot on on this podcast because it’s always a shame that
people don’t people outside of the industry and I don’t think quite realize um the benefits of of coming and working
in the tech sector oh in terms of the tech sector you know is it a great industry for the
neurodiverse we know as we said there it’s a great industry for everybody what
about if you’re a neurodivergent I always say it’s an incredibly amazing
industry to work in if you have a neurodiversity and there are lots of reasons for that there are many companies that are even actively looking
for people uh who have a neurodivergence for example gchq uh are always have an
active recruitment stream for people with dyslexia and so that might be around sort of cyber security you’re
likely to be better if you have neurodiversity because of the way your brain is wired to be able to spot
patterns and problem solve if you have autism for example high functioning
autism you’re highly likely to be able to sit and do one thing for a long period of time to be
um to be really sort of able to focus on uh if you’re if there is something around for example cyber security your
ability to or to code something the ability to sit and focus would be at a phenomenal level compared to
neurotypical uh people um people with um dyslexia are well
known to have fantastic problem solving things skills to be creative to think outside the box so for me
um a lot of what happens with technology is actually about as around innovating uh innovating new business models
Innovative Airbnb and Uber for example their new business model so the
technology by itself is is not enough you have to have um
creative skills to sort of think outside the box as to applying technology in one
particular way in in another business scenario um and so that can help too there’s many
people with um ADHD who are phenomenally successful uh in technology as well
because their ability to sort of um to to multitask and to get stuff done
and ability there’s two different types of ADHD actually so there are some that find it some some people have both
actually it’s both types but some people with ADHD find it pretty easy to focus
on something very sort of uh get in the zone if you give them I don’t know a web
development project they would just be intensely focused and be able to get that done and be very committed to
achieving that to a higher standard so I think that there are every what I would say is that every for every different
type of neurodiversity there are different superpowers that you’re likely to have but everybody who has those
diversities their own they will have a different version of it so just because you’ve met somebody who’s had dyslexia
at school and they might have had a very severe form and their handwriting is
illegible and they can’t spell but you might have another person who’s dyslexic
like myself I find I would actually say that writing um is actually one of my strengths I can
write very well or I can edit and copy my other people’s stuff and so I think this
um sometimes people have uh assumptions or stereotypes that they associate with
different diversities I think it’s important to be open-minded that naughty people are the same uh even when it
comes to neurodiversity and that it’s important to help people and if you’ve got kids to help them find their own
superpowers because they absolutely will have uh incredible talents that other
people that are neurotypical would wouldn’t even have a hope to to to
compete on and it’s probably something as you said there everybody’s very different
um and and everybody has different challenges so it’s probably something that people just don’t pick up on if
they don’t know the signs or if you know it’s it is different for lots of people then you know just like yourself it
might be actually something that that comes up far later in life than you know a parent noticing or a teacher noticing
at school if we don’t quite understand what we’re looking for yeah and you know what’s interesting for me is that in my
working career um actually sometimes you can uncover that you have a neurodiversity because your kids get um diagnosed because it is
more sort of accepted and so sometimes we’ve I’ve remember a situation where a guy came into work he was actually a bit
sad and he said oh my child who’s quite young has been diagnosed with autism and
um then I remember myself and my colleague going that really explains a lot actually that his ability his
phenomenal loyalty to the business which people with autism have like they would and they’re likely to stay with you
forever they work very hard incredibly committed um personalities
um and that was describing him he was phenomenal hard worker we had to literally like he might be there wanted
to work late at night we’d have to say no you need to call it a day and you need to look after these people who have
this immense loyalty to make sure they don’t overworked um but it’s incredible and I think I
would say the same for dyslexic people a lot of dyslexic people have this almost subconscious thought of they’re not good
enough or they haven’t done very well or they need to work harder to get the same results so you tend to find that their
ability to to graft really is at a phenomenal level and I’ve seen that very
often uh they can tend to be it’s almost like they’re trying to compensate so they just work super super hard to get
to the standards that they set themselves which are usually very very high then higher than other people would set for them and and that’s I guess for
a business it’s quite good yeah because I was going to ask you there about about the benefits of of
hiring um a neurodiversion uh Tech Workforce but as you said they you know individuals that are incredibly loyal
especially I suppose if they find a company that’s very supportive supportive of them and very encouraging
um of them then as you say they’re going to be very loyal and they’re going to stick around for some time but I suppose
also just the diversity of thought as well you know you really don’t want the team that
everybody thinks the same way um so so that must be uh an absolute benefit of you know a company hiring
somebody that’s neurodiverse definitely well I think there’s so much happening in the tech sector that can automate
things but I don’t think you can automate creativity yes um and so I think that you if for any
business to remain in business you have to constantly innovate you have to listen to your uh customers you have to
be able to spot Trends uh which many neurodiverse people are very good at
um it’s almost like you in my mind diverse neurodiverse people can sit in a helicopter above the world and see
what’s happening when other people are in the the thick of the trees and they don’t quite see it the same way and for
me when I’m I’m a very visual um thinker and so I find it very easy to
explain complex ideas in very simple ways especially using similes for
example and metaphors and and also to um to draw if I’m if I’m thinking about
uh explaining I don’t know it could be a marketing strategy I find it very easy to be able to think of a picture that
represents what we’re trying to achieve and have everyone on the same page and as a leader or a Visionary or even a an
entrepreneur and a business founder the ability to be able to spot Trends and to
um think of the bigger picture and and on linked Trends to potential Solutions
and to be able to articulate and communicate that with people is really powerful and a huge asset for any
company if they want to remain in business and to create huge value for their future growth yeah and it is one
of those misconceptions as well isn’t it they that the tech industry isn’t creative and and when you started your
answer there it was you know about the importance of being creative and having creative individuals
um which as you as you mentioned they’re just the superpower of having that bird’s eye view of everything
um I think that there is that just that that myth isn’t there that’s Tech sector you don’t need to be
creative you’re just gonna sit with your headphones on code and not talk to anyone well there’s a lot that now that
a lot of roles now even technical roles you might call it that there’s no coding and certainly the products that I work
with Microsoft Dynamics and there are many projects that don’t require any coding uh it’s more about sitting with a
client and understanding what their business model is and how they uh what their processes are and aligning the
system uh in a sort of drag and drop way um it’s it’s definitely doesn’t require
technical skills and we’ve had many people in our business who haven’t come from a technical background we had one
young lady who had done a psychology degree so she was very she wants to be a
data scientist and so she’s very good about um sort of putting herself in other
people’s shoes and she had strong empathy to be able to wish women I think have an abundance often uh to be able to
sort of think outside the box and to be able to once you understand the technology how can that support
um a business for example and so she she adapted very well without necessarily
having deep technical skills because not it’s not always required to work in a Consulting capacity to have that deep
technical knowledge or even even coding skills and I would also say
um for me one of the great things about one of the secret ways you could say I’ve been trying to sort of interact
Talent uh female Talent into our industry which definitely uh we need more of is and through the marketing
channel because as uh whenever we advertise any marketing rules it’s amazing there’s very often they are uh
females coming through so and getting them through and helping our clients is is a great way of doing that
yeah yeah and what about yourself as well um as an entrepreneur and and a
Founder did you find you mentioned there so there’s so many roles in Tech that don’t require require you to be techy
did is that something that you thought before you founded a business did you
think I have to have all these technical skills to be able to do that you know you sharing that your dyslexic yourself
did you think there were going to be challenges there I would say uh over the years I
I probably have always had an interest in technology as a young kid for example I I had a Commodore 64 and I’d even go
to the library and buy books on sort of doing basic and I really enjoyed I really enjoyed doing that the bit that I
didn’t enjoy was the debugging it if it didn’t work I didn’t think I had the patience I wasn’t brilliant at that and
however I’ve always been super interested in technology but I’ve never got to a deep technical level because
um actually what you know when I joined IBM many years ago I was hired in a sales capacity
and I’ve spent a lot of my career in sales which is also a very rewarding role in Tech and so part of the course
part of the induction for me was they sent me on a um a course to learn how to develop the
product which was a COBOL um couldn’t be more Technical and so uh
it was it was quite glamorous in some ways because I was sent over to the states to Newport Rhode Island which is a beautiful place with an amazing team
and so what I learned really quickly was to use my charm as part of teams to make
sure that if I needed to do the exercises that I had to help and so being the only female I think on
the course I had lots of offers of help to help me so it wasn’t it proved not to be an issue but it showed me is to put
yourself in a place of your strengths and ask for help when you need it and actually one of the pieces of advice
that I give to my female colleagues when they join is guys always love to help and so women
women if you want to play to your strengths often don’t aren’t ashamed to ask for help so take advantage and don’t
be shy uh because many of your colleagues will absolutely love to help you in anything
that you may need and I think what I often do is probably pretend that I’m a bit less technical than I am and then I
get all these offers of can I help you and it’s fantastic um so I’ve had that mindset of of never
let never really minding uh sort of what I don’t know because there’s always someone who does and if you’re not
trying to ask then there’s always many people willing to pay it forward and support you and also these days many
resources online if you if you’re good at self learning to help you as well yeah oh absolutely
yeah with online learning especially in the tech sector um there are so many wonderful resources
to draw from and in terms of uh neurodiversity do you think there are
certain negative stereotypes when it comes to neurodiversity I I’m sure there
are I think there’s a lot of misconceptions like I mentioned earlier people assume that there’s Lexi people can’t read and write and it couldn’t be
further from the truth I read like I might have got a what feels like a library of books that I love to read and
I love to write um but I think it’s important that and people are what they need to
understand is that people with neurodiversity their way their brains are wired differently and so the way
they think the way they come to decisions the way they possibly even process information or see information
is just different and if you don’t
um if somebody doesn’t appear like you then it’s just really important to try and understand well what are their
strengths what are their superpowers and I I just spend the time to get to know
what are their you what do they ask them what what are your unique superpowers or if you are
um if you if you do have a diversity then a neurodiversity then to share with people I would encourage people if
they’re applying for jobs even to share that and you might want to say hey I’ve I’ve sort of mild or high functioning
autism and how it shows itself is I’m especially good if you give me this this
and this and and I might need extra help with this this and this and the same with any neurodiversity I think it’s
really important and if if you’ve got somebody with ADHD it might be that you need to just help them prioritize
and because I’ll try and do it all and or everything’s exciting and they’ll probably take on too much so give them
fewer projects with clear deadlines um and yeah I think that can help so I
think you just need to spend the time to get to know what people’s
um superpowers are and make sure you’re not overlooking using those in the business I do recall there was somebody
in my business who had um neurodiversity uh it wasn’t it was
undiagnosed but it was quite clear to me because he was so highly creative he had
on any subject you may ask him about he had just a huge incredible spectrum of
ideas and they were all brilliant I would say um the only challenge is just there was so much of it so uh but I think you do
need to create a space for capturing and
um because some of those ideas I’m sure won’t you won’t want to take forward but many of them could be creating for
normal future value for your business if somebody your business is able to spot those Trends and and leverage those for
your business growth yeah and is there anything that you think companies can do
I mean you mentioned there are a few things you know um that teams can do helping um somebody
prioritize their tasks for instance I suppose as well it’s it’s about educating other people on the team as
well about how they can help and that individual is that something you’ve you’ve found yourself yeah I think first
of all I would say encourage a conversation about it because it’s um better to make people confident that
they can share that they might have a diverse neurodiversity um it could be that you uh if for
example you know that somebody has autism high functioning autism you will
need to make sure that the manager understands how that may impact their
performance and in terms of for example making sure they take breaks making sure they don’t work too hard uh making sure
they leave at the end of the day and yeah that they would do it because that can lead to maybe their home life and
might suffer and then that that will then have an impact or potentially they might not be eating properly if they’re
working too hard somebody with um dyslexia don’t ask them to do something in the corridor uh that they then have
to remember when they get back to the desk what was that that I was asked to do because I certainly couldn’t remember and you might have difficulty in
Remembering names or things like that certainly I do and so if you’ve got an
event on encouraging people or you have a even a large internal event it might
be helpful to put people’s names and departments or whatever it could be that you have um this is what I do I’ve got a A4
posters you could call it with people’s pictures and names and what they do in a bit about them and as the company grows
and that can make it easier to remember everybody’s name if you’re not great at that uh it could be that you have
systems to help people um organize their work and so if you
don’t have a sort of CRM system for example for managing your callbacks or if you don’t have to do less or things
like that but just making things like planner or to-do lists or things like that available to the employee so that
they can manage their workload um better would be quite important as
well um so I think yeah just having good levels of of communication
um and creating a safe environment where people are not shy to share where they
might need extra support um it might be that you assign a buddy to somebody who
um is informed about what somebody’s challenges might be so they have somebody or it could be a mentor and so
they they don’t feel isolated um from the Norms so if you’ve got a company full of I don’t know more highly
um I don’t know sort of numbers focused people or whatever then maybe you might
feel intimidated by that so it’s just creating a safe environment where you feel you can be yourself
yeah and what about the the employee themselves you know what what can they do to to harness their own superpowers
at work so I would encourage them to if they’re not aware of if they haven’t yet discovered their superpowers
um then certainly spend time to do so I think for me it was actually if it was
an incredible time for me when I actually had the diagnosis because until then I felt you could say maybe a bit
more intimidated and negative about some of the things the traits and I always
assumed everybody was like me and I think maybe we go through life assuming
that that we’re all on this spectrum of normal and and then when I realized that
actually people don’t have a million a million ideas a minute and when they’re walking down the street that people
don’t have um for me as a dyslexic I have an abundance of energy and I that that’s a
lot of people don’t uh or I have the ability to see things very visually
um other people don’t so just try to I appreciate that actually how you think
um is assume that it’s actually different assume a lot of about you is different and try to discover
uh how whilst there are some annoying things um that you might for me for example if
I was to write a shopping list I couldn’t I couldn’t spell probably most of the things the words on the shopping list because I don’t write those words
every day if it was business terms I could spell them perfectly um so try to to be kind on yourself for
the things that aren’t your strengths but also uh try to appreciate that
actually the things that you took for granted um about how your brain works are unique
to you and others with that neurodiversity and and to really
um absolutely Embrace that and it might be that you could set up if you’re if you’re in a big organization you could set up some larger
um groups uh to sort of to share experiences of of and then the more you
learn about other people they might go oh I think like that too or yeah I have that
um yeah I found that easy or I found that a challenge and people have different strategies for how they sort
of organize themselves and how they apply their talents uh that can be a
great thing yeah and I suppose it’s always remembering as well that that they are
an advantage to you I think you use the word then different and you know you
sort of think I’m different or I think differently but actually it’s not a negative thing
um and that that you can use that uh to your advantage in the workplace but what
do you think do you have any advice for you know neurodivergent employees who are struggling at work
maybe they’re in the wrong role um absolutely right you don’t feel
supported then but it could be in the wrong company if they’re in a company that isn’t
sympathetic or supportive and there’s probably a few out there like that I would I would encourage companies to
sorry employer employees to sort of um talk about be really open I remember
years ago I was working with a membership organization and I was in sales I was a sales director and I
worked with this I.T director in a in a client of mine and for me as a as a
dyslexic I could see black and white he was um he was dyslexia I could see that and
I didn’t feel the need to say that to him but I could see how and where he needed support uh and I think that it’s
important to um to be confident that in in your own
in your own talents and I think uh if you if you’re if you’re in a role that
doesn’t value the superpowers that you believe you have I think you need to find a new roller if the organization
supports you and you feel supported to be you and there there’s a new trend in
um sort of workplace psychology which is called strengths-based um sort of it’s playing to your
strengths really um and it’s important that you understand have a hard think about what
are your personal strengths and how might your business
um really value and use those strengths and just be like at the end of the day
if it was me um first of all you can’t be fired for being neurodiverse so don’t be shy to
share that you have a neurodiversity be clear in your mind about if you had a
magic wand and you needed extra support what might that be it might be just somebody being clear on what the
priorities are and it could be um sort of sort of if you feel you have
a particular talent and you’re um if for example if you have ADHD and you’re just given a really what you
might feel is a boring role that’s not challenging you you’re going to be really unhappy so make sure that you
share um the fact that you you need to be challenged and you need Variety in your role and if you have autism the chances
are you won’t want to stand up and present you won’t to be in a at conferences possibly or busy or new
environments you want stability and predictability and you want people to work with people that you know not to be
thrown in the deep end with lots of new faces that would be a highly stressful situation so it’s really important that
you are honest and I don’t I don’t I can’t imagine it being anything but stressful for any employee who’s in a
position where they’re not playing to their strengths and they can’t be themselves they’re masking the
challenges and the stresses and stress over time can take take its toll on you and I think
um there’s so many thousands of not millions of jobs out there that would be perfect for you so be brave and make a
change and just become more self-aware of how your unique strengths can be a phenomenal value for any employer yeah
and I think and as you say you know for any employees well being at a company where you don’t feel anybody’s really
listening to your needs and how you like to work um is is incredibly stressful I remember
thinking sometimes um I might have been in working sessions you know where where you’re supposed to
put words on Post-it notes and put them on the wall and I’m standing here thinking I’m quite introverted this is
not how I like to work and I’m not you know in this creative Vibe that’s
supposed to be happening I would rather just disappear and go and do my own working in my own time and come back or
you know even present back but I think it’s just a company or your team
listening to how you work um how you work well and uh obviously if you’re neurodiverse and that comes with
a unique set of challenges so it’s just finding that company that really listens to to you and believes you instead of
you know trying to push you to be somebody that that you’re not um we are almost out of time and I just
wanted to ask you um one more thing uh what more can be done to raise awareness
of neurodiversity in the workplace do you think I definitely think that um first of all
of the recruitment stage I think if you if uh if people are applying for jobs
um I think that one thing that we do is we ask people and what additional support they may need
um and I think any it’s a legal obligation any way that you can make reasonable adjustments for anyone in the
workplace but to encourage people um to think about it what based on their
personal situation what additional support systems or other things and so
having that in your recruitment process but I would suggest that you do that
after offer not before offer so that you’re not seen to be prejudiced uh to
just making um the support that making available the support that people may need I think
it’s always great if a company has the opportunity to offer buddying or mentoring or even both sort of um
systems so that people feel that they can go to someone who’s not their manager if they feel they need support
or help or somebody who they feel they can they might say I’m really struggling with my workload and I can’t manage all
the different priorities and I’m not sure what to do and they feel like they’re failing actually they might be
that because of the neurodiversity they just need a little extra coaching on being I
don’t know prioritizing or organizing the many different things that are coming at them and one thing that ADHD
and dyslexia people are very good at is coming up with so many ideas of things they need to work on they can be overworked and so it might be someone to
come along go actually do you know what that’s just a bit you don’t need to be doing that let’s be realistic
um I certainly need to be grounded in myself I have so many ideas um
and I think that’s important um and I think that if if you’re um I
think it’s great that’s a good great practice anyway for any business but to make sure that if there are actions agreed in a meeting that they’re written
up and shared because they can be um for people who have uh dyslexia for
example they might have it find it more difficult to remember stuff uh there’s a lot of Technology as well that can
transcribe it could be meetings or other uh things that so if you can make that
available in different forms that’s great too um if you if it if it’s appropriate um
so for me in my business for example I’m setting up um a learning management system we’ve actually called Cloud on Academy and
it’s really a fantastic way of us recording content that helps people in
their career and so certainly for some Learners they might need to look at it
more than once or maybe just a meeting isn’t enough you know if you’re being taught how to use something new for the first time it might be helpful to sort
of record that and make it available for them to to to go over a few times for
example so um there are some of the things that we do I also have uh in
um for a number of people in my business I’ve purchased a remarkable which is a digital notepad and which for me if I
don’t write something down it’s probably not going to get up in my head so yeah if you’re if you’re on a computer you
don’t always want to be typing um so yeah maybe giving them access like if in a week I could probably fill a few
notebooks with my notes um so having a digital remarkable pad
has been life-changing for me and many others in my business who I I notice
they write a lot so it doesn’t mean they’re neurodivergent uh but there’s a
highly likelihood that they could well be okay especially if they’re highly
creative if you if they’re always the person with the ideas uh there’s a likely chance they could be
and it’s interesting it’s interesting as well that um you know a lot of stems from just making
sure that that you you mentioned it a little bit before that you speak up and that you you’re not shy and that you ask
because I think probably a lot of neurodiverse people they might have had a bad experience perhaps it might have
not been confidence and they feel like they just can’t ask but actually from the sounds of it you know the more you
ask the more people are just willing to help um and to come up with Solutions like
you just suggested so I think it’s probably just staying positive and and um and asking for support I would agree
and the moment my sort of State of Mind around neurodiversity is I think that my
ambition is that we’ll get to a stage in our society where everyone is valued for
being them you appreciate that everyone has something unique about them we’re
all uh sort of we all have different things to bring or different talents and
that we’re not treated as clones we’re all is unique and that in my view
certainly as a dyslexic um the dyslexia people are less likely to have gone to University so it’s
important that employers don’t Prejudice about them I need them to have a first because well unlikely necessarily most
of the dyslexic will necessarily ever gone for us because their memory wouldn’t be as good or maybe because of how they’ve been treated at school and
made to feel stupid and because they’re poor memory that they might not have attained the grades to get the course
that they wanted so there are so they’ve been so many barriers put in their way and so in my view that our society is
the challenge and how the society thinks I think that eventually my point of view is that eventually we’ll all be
cherished as Unique Individuals and that Society won’t have the stereotypical
negative perceptions that are holding people back and I certainly don’t allow
that to happen in my in my world I I feel phenomenally gifted very lucky I would
never not be dyslexic I feel there are so many especially entrepreneurs and
it’s a highly successful people in the world who have a neurodiversity and and
recently I was invited to talk about entrepreneurship at London visit school and I asked for a show of hand so people who had different neurodiversities and
it felt like about of about uh sort of 50 to 60 people in the room about a third of the room put their hand up this
is like the creme de La Creme of society of intelligent people so that’s how I
view it I think that if you’re if you’re lucky enough to be neurodiverse uh make
sure you don’t waste it because uh sort of ignore the stereotypes and find your
unique you and talk about it yeah
end on there because we are out of time Colleen I’m so sorry that we could talk about this all afternoon
um but we’re already out of phone so thank you so much for coming in and chatting with us today it’s been really really interesting
pleasure thank you and to everybody listening as always thank you so much for joining us and we hope to see you
again next time
